Six Smart Women Discussing Doctor Who

VerityEpisode64This week sees the last entry in our year of villains. Join Deb, Erika, Liz, and Lynne as we chat about one of the most interesting villains of them all. Who could it be? Why, it’s the Doctor himself! There are more than a few times our beloved “hero” does things that are far less-than-heroic. We talk about a number of examples, why they are (or aren’t) really villainous, and even slide into a conversation about the nature of evil! Deep stuff. Sorta.

What do you think about the Doctor as a villain? Let us know in the comments.

^E

Also covered:

Download or listen now (runtime 1:17:05) 

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Comments on: "Verity! Episode 64 – Dark, Dangerous Doctor" (15)

  1. I haven’t listened to the episode yet (my Ipod is acting wonky)…but I wonder how you all brought up and discussed AN UNEARTHLY CHILD. The first serial is definitely a Doctor Behaving Badly.

  2. Chuck C said:

    Looks like Big Finish has teamed up with Humble Bundle. I’m guessing this is worth the $15 or so? 🙂

    https://www.humblebundle.com/books

  3. Happy Holidays, Verities!

    Just listened to the latest episode and wanted to kill a couple of birds with one episode in particular. “Love and Monsters”, which is one of my will-never-watch-again episodes, is basically a “collateral damage” story that Lynn was wanting to see in the series. It’s mostly from the point-of-view of a character (Elton) who was emotionally scarred by an event (the death of his mother) in which the Doctor was involved. I’ve only seen this once so forgive me if I’m remembering that bit wrong. And aside from that one joke at the end which I can’t describe as yours is a family-friendly podcast, the other thing that really upset me enough to never watch this again was the Doctor’s actions at the end when, instead of letting Elton’s girlfriend die, he decided to play god and let her live as a slab of granite, which is no life at all! Does he not remember what happened to Boursa in The Game of Rassilon?!? I thought the Doctor should’ve let this character die with dignity. A lot of fans felt the same way about his choosing to save Donna by wiping her memory rather that respect her wishes to die as the Doctor-Donna.

    Also, a suggestion. The “on this week’s Verity” snippets at the beginning ran a bit too long this time and practically spoiled the entire podcast. we’re going to listen to the whole thing anyway, so perhaps you can keep those as short as possible? They usually are, but for some reason this week’s felt like it went on for almost two minutes.

    Looking forward to your assessment on “Last Christmas” – probably more than I’m looking forward to the episode itself.

    JB

    • My holiday gift to myself each year is to be a wee bit self-indulgent and nab not one, but two lines from everyone for the cold open of at least one episode. It’s become a bit of a Verity! tradition. I’m sorry if it almost spoiled the podcast for you, but I’m not sorry I did it. It makes things extra fun (and easier!), so merry Christmas to me!

      It may even happen again (I haven’t decided yet), so be ready with the fast forward button next ep! Then of course, it’s back to the usual for another year.

      ^E

      • Oh, and I’m glad you do listen to the whole podcast! That’s certainly not the case for everyone who DLs it, so we appreciate returning listeners who’re onboard for the whole ride.

        ^E

      • FWIW, I always enjoy the quotes at the beginning of each episode. A double helping is just extra fun! Erika, you might think of it as self-indulgent, but you’re really not the only one who gets a kick out of it 🙂

  4. bekitty3 said:

    My vote for most villainous Doctor was the Eighth Doctor in the Big Finish story “The Natural History of Fear”. It’s one of the stories in the Divergent Universe arc (the one that starts with “Scherzo”) and it’s HELLA disturbing, right the way through. Very Orwellian.

    Technically, since the cast all play different characters, Paul McGann isn’t ACTUALLY playing the Doctor at the point where’s he’s at his most creepy, but hearing his voice doing what he’s doing? *shudder*

  5. I don’t know that he was villainous, but the Doctor came across rather unfeeling at times in series 8 and there were times when the viewers were left questioning. Thanks for a wrap up of Who villains. Even though I didn’t discover your podcast until fall, I’ve gone back and I think I’ve listened to them all. I particularly enjoyed the one where you discussed the killer daffodils (probably not the most effective weapon) and also the one where you talked about the monster designs. Thanks for a great year. I’m excited to see what you have in store for next year. PS: My husband gave me an eleven sonic for Christmas. This after spending the year watching all of New Who just so he’d know what I was talking about. What a guy.

  6. Tony Cross said:

    I always like to use a quote from the film ‘Prophecy’ re. the Doctor. “Did you ever notice how in the Bible, when ever God needed to punish someone, or make an example, or whenever God needed a killing, he sent an angel? Did you ever wonder what a creature like that must be like…with one wing dipped in blood. Would you ever really want to see an angel? ”

    But I’m a bit strange that way.

    • Korina said:

      I LOVE that movie! Whenever I am assaulted by yet another misty image of a beautiful woman dressed in too much fabric, I think of this and smile.

      That analogy never occurred to me before… ::shivers::

  7. Villanous things – First Doctor: The Daleks, using the fluid link as an excuse so the Doctor almost kills his companions and makes the Thals fight and die just to satisfy his curiousity.
    Second Doctor – manipulating Jamie in Evil of the Daleks
    Third Doctor: Constant snapping at everyone until his exile is lifted
    Fourth Doctor: The way he treats most people in the Seeds of Doom. Making the guys in the Antarctic base perform the operation even though he could have helped (see Kill the Moon)
    Sixth Doctor: Vengence on Varos
    Seventh Doctor: Treatment of Ace in season 26
    Tenth Doctor: Waters of Mars
    Eleventh Doctor: A good man goes to war
    Twelfth Doctor: the first half of season 8

    So, a dark Doctor is fascinating, thankfully seeing him so happy at the end of Last Christmas, let’s hope he will be the idiot with the box

  8. Korina said:

    Oddly, the first story that popped into my mind was The Pandorica Opens, where we get a glimpse of the Doctor from the outside. Which was the culmination of Season 6, as you all mentioned.

    Not *exactly* villainous, but what he did to the Family of Blood gave us a pretty good look at what happens to people who piss him off, and how that thin thread of conscience and morality keeps his power in check, and what happens when it frays. Waters of Mars shows what happens when it snaps. Makes me think of the old maxim ‘power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely’.

    My favorite villainous Verity! was the silent villains. I do love a good tangent. 🙂

  9. Laurissy said:

    Really great podcast guys I think my dark doctor moment would be 9 convincing a dalek to kill themselves. It’s such a dark moment for me. Got to admit kind of surprised to see the 10th doctor described as dark in anyway. You see for me the rtd era is my happy place. I discovered doctor who when I was 11 and I honestly can’t think badly of any episode in that era. There are episodes that I think are bad but to be honest I don’t think I can really hate any of them. It’s my childhood and I will love 10 forever and ever.

    Got to admit I’m surprised to hear Lynne say that he thought leaving susan on earth was dark I don’t see it that way. For me it’s not the doctor abandoning susan he’s letting her live her own life. You see I started watching the Hartnell era when I was in university and I felt some empathy for susan who to me it always felt like someone in a similar situation to me. Someone who has no idea what she wants to do with her life and is not really pushing herself in any direction. The doctor knows that Susan needs to learn to rely on herself and her own abilities and to do that she needs time by herself. I don’t believe that the doctor believes that he’ll never see Susan again. He knows that they’ll see each other again and when he does she’ll be different which is ok. I’m not sure if I’m putting some of my own life onto susan but to me for the doctor leaving the susan on earth is the equivalent of her having a gap year of course it went horribly wrong but that’s doctor who for you.

  10. AbsolomDaak said:

    I can’t really comment to much on when the Doctor was at his most villainous, mainly because I’m so far behind in the Big Finish stories. but even when the Doctor was the villain, his wan’t necessarily the bad guy.

  11. Christopher P said:

    For me personally? I felt the Doctor was at his most villainous when he engineered the downfall of Harriett Jones. I felt she made a pretty good point about the Earth defending itself in the Doctor’s absence and arguably, she saved whatever world the Sycorax were going to victimize next. I like that the Doctor can do things I disapprove of. Or arguably, that he makes mistakes 😉

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