Six Smart Women Discussing Doctor Who

verityepisode128It’s high time we started on the love part of our year of love and lasts. Join Deb, Erika, Liz, and Lynne as we cover Lynne’s love, “The Girl in the Fireplace”. Liz and Deb do some LJ fanthropology, Erika has a change of heart, and Lynne gushes about France and frocks. Of course we do our usual random-tangent thing too. X-men fighting leprechauns, anyone?

What did (and do) you think of this ep? Do you love it like Lynne or hate it like an old-school Rose/10 shipper? Or somewhere in between? Let us know in the comments!

^E

Also covered:

Download or listen now (runtime 1:16:38) 

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Comments on: "Episode 128 – Lynne’s Love: Frocks and Fireplaces" (21)

  1. Oh dear! I’m trying to download this week’s podcast but am getting a ‘no file’ error message. 😦

  2. terminuspodcast said:

    First off, I ❤ ❤ 'Girl in the Fireplace' so much (or as the haters call(ed) it: 'GitFace').

    Glad that Lynne brought up the polyamory angle as I even wrote meta (on LJ!) about that very thing back in the day, but it didn't go over too well at the time, as I think I was mostly talking to that Ten/Rose bitter part of fandom who wouldn't hear any of it:

    'Ouroboros: The Girl in the Fireplace & the Cycle of Love and Loss in the Doctor's Life'
    http://dwrewatch.livejournal.com/55072.html

    Oh, and as for the thing about Rose and Mickey being stranded, I just assumed they could get home via one of the TARDIS's Emergency Programs. And I think Moffat did too, as I seem to recall him saying in an interview he had that in an earlier draft, but dropped it as he just assumed that people would just remember the Emergency Programs and so it 'wasn't necessary to mention'. He was wrong though, obviously, as it is a common complaint/criticism/observation about the episode. But, oh well.

    Also, to be fair, much like Lynne, as someone who has been a long time fan of the Classic Series, I wasn't really worried as I just believed the Doctor would figure things out somehow, as he always — well, *usually* (Fivey had some issues with that, in particular) — figures out a solution to things (another reason I love the retcon in 'Day of the Doctor', BTW, as I never believed that he wouldn't have found a way to avoid using the Moment).

    P.S. God, the hate for this story on LJ was so insane to watch some times! Do you remember all the airlock fics? I personally can remember so many fics where the Doctor airlocked Reinette, as he laughed maniacly with Rose or whatever. It was an odd time!

  3. terminuspodcast said:

    By the way, I forgot to add: One fannish thing I love about ‘Girl in the Fireplace’ is the return of that one beautiful frock from ‘Black Orchid’:

  4. Reblogged this on Confessions of a Curator, Editor, Geek and commented:

    New Verity! In which I GUSH about Girl in the Fireplace, my fave story ever.

  5. Have to say one thing: I kept smiling and thinking of MST3K every time Deb said “robuts” instead of “robots.” I wish I knew why… 🙂

  6. nonelvis said:

    To answer Erika’s question about whether certain parts of fandom had the same “her life revolves around the Doctor” objection to Reinette that they do about River: yes, I can definitely recall seeing that argument, though the shippers — because it was always Doctor/Rose shippers making the argument — generally argued it as “Reinette is badly written/undercharacterized/just Moffat’s dream woman.” And while I agree with Deb’s point that River’s story was ongoing and therefore there was less to object to, the Doctor/Rose ship was still in full swing in S4, especially with Rose’s unexpected appearances throughout the series. So anything that was perceived as a threat to the ship had to be attacked using whatever argument was handy, no matter how valid (or not) it might be.

    • Thanks for the answer! I’m always curious whether other fans see the same similarities I do (and then react to them equally if they do).

  7. Another fabulous podcast! Sorry for pestering you with my technical problems.

    I must say that I am totally on board Liz’s “pay artists more” train. 😀

  8. Neil A Ottenstein said:

    Just started to listen to Lynn’s squee about one of my favorite episodes – Girl in the Fireplace. It is wonderful hearing her talking about this.

  9. Sometimes I hate listening to the podcast, because I can’t just jump in and talk! ;-D

    I despise romance as a genre, and I still love this episode. Partly it’s just so well done: I got caught up in the adventure story, and didn’t really notice the love story until later. Also, I don’t see it as necessarily a love story in the romantic sense. I think the Doctor saw in Reinette what he sees in any of his companions, and he was heartbroken in the end because he failed her. Just as he has (in his view anyway) failed so many of them.

    I’m not sure I saw it on the first pass but over time I definitely see this as a story about faith. The Doctor always jumps in feet first when there’s someone to save, and to hell with the consequences – and somehow it always turns out. He knows when he plunges through the mirror that there’s no way back, and yet he does it believing that he will make it back anyway. (This gets spelled out even bigger in “The Satan Pit,” where the Doctor destroys the safety net only to come up against the TARDIS in the shadows.) Rose too has faith – and her own desire to save the day. If he had asked her whether he should save Reinette or stay behind with her, I feel quite confident she would have told him to get on that horse – and come back in the end too. Which of course he does, because he’s the Doctor. I think this episode showcases Rose’s compassion and faith as well as the Doctor’s, as well as the strength of their friendship. And I don’t think he abandoned her, in any case: the TARDIS took Rose home once, and I’m sure she’d have done it again if called on. As if Rose would ever have left the Doctor behind. (again, see “The Satan Pit.”)

    Madame de Pompadour was quite an interesting person historically. She was married, and was mistress to the King, and was the first of that King’s mistresses to befriend the Queen. (The Doctor’s comment about this being France was dead on.) She was interested in science and art and politics and brought the most intelligent and well educated people together in her house to talk about things. I think the Doctor would definitely have admired her. I really enjoy the way she’s portrayed in the story: smart, fearless, fiery, and also feminine. As in the show, she died of tuberculosis slowly and quite young, leaving behind a grieving King. She’s an excellent choice of character for an episode of Doctor Who. I’d love to see more fascinating women from history on the show.

  10. So, I had a thought that I’ve not had before, inspired by your conversation as I was.

    It seems to me that Amy Pond’s character and story arc is the fully fleshed out version of Reinette. They both meet the Doctor as children and proceed to have their childhoods profoundly shaped by the encounter. They both fall for the Doctor, but choose other loves and live out their lives, specifically to old age, away from the Doctor. For both Amy and Reinette, interference in their timelines by aliens both cause both their initial encounters with the Doctor and their separation from him. I like it!

    Sorry do the delay in my comment. You know, life…

  11. Thank you Lynne, for bringing up the polyamory aspect. I’ve slowly been working out my own response to the Doctor’s relationships, and I couldn’t quite join it all up. Just you speaking the word made it all shake into place so very much better. That was my missing piece, giving me an “oh duh, of course” moment. Thank you, thank you.

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